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"letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
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Author:  Sniper [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:04 am ]
Post subject:  "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
Edit: this was originally a question for Kidd and Grinus but The Kidd already gave the answer.
....

This is for Kidd and Grinus but after they reply other guys are more than welcome to share their insights...

I feel as if there is something I'm not doing right or not fully getting yet.... :(

Over the past week I have done a lot of observations and inner work. I do the things I love by myself, I'm hanging out with friends that I like, I'm supposed to finish my studies soon and I have a part time job- so I'm not bored.

Then why do I still feel like I can't fully let go of Needing women yet?

*It's not the sex that I need so much
and
*I already know that women are not angels and what "true love" really is: a perception of value...

I don't feel needy like I used to so I made amazing progress, but why can't I still let it go? :roll:

Ask me any question you want, and I'll give you an answer- maybe then I will finally figure it out.
I think it might have something to do with being raised mostly by my mom but I can't pin point it....
Author:  The Kidd!! [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Ok this is a tough one about "letting go", thoughts?
Because a part of you still believes that women just can't be the imperfect beings we have proved them to be...can't help you with that, mate. :geek:
Author:  Sniper [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Ok this is a tough one about "letting go", thoughts?
The Kidd!! wrote:
Because a part of you still believes that women just can't be the imperfect beings we have proved them to be...can't help you with that, mate. :geek:
Ok that could be it, but let me ask you something else:

We have been raised by our moms, our moms were good to us (or at least did their best....).
Now could it be that when we grow up, a part of us wants to find a woman that will give us the same feeling that our moms gave us?

or in other words: could it be that we were 'conditioned' to feel good when our moms gave us good feelings and then even though we see that no woman will be like our mom- we are still searching for those good feelings our mom gave us in other women?

can you relate to what I'm saying?
Author:  The Kidd!! [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Ok this is a tough one about "letting go", thoughts?
Sure can...AND NO OTHER WOMAN YOU WILL MEET HAS GIVEN BIRTH TO YOU.

Now...can you relate to what I'M saying? :geek:
Author:  Sniper [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Ok this is a tough one about "letting go", thoughts?
The Kidd!! wrote:
Sure can...AND NO OTHER WOMAN YOU WILL MEET HAS GIVEN BIRTH TO YOU.

Now...can you relate to what I'M saying? :geek:
Yes sir :)
and yet we were conditioned to believe that one day we will find a woman who will love us like our mom or provoke the same feelings that our mom gave us.

I think that women know it and a lot of them are playing this card on guys in order to get them.
Author:  The Kidd!! [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
A woman can only play you if you agree to play their game. 8-)
Author:  Star_Above [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
Me and 'Grinus talked about this, even our mothers play guilt trips on us; "You can't come home for Christmas, you're busy? You're going to hurt the families feelings so much". Even if we have a legite reason and it's in our best intrest.

They still look out for their own intrests more than yours, swallow that fuck'n pill!!! Mothers aren't perfect man, everyone is still guided by self-intrest...EVERYONE!
Author:  GoldenBoy [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Ok this is a tough one about "letting go", thoughts?
Sniper wrote:
We have been raised by our moms, our moms were good to us (or at least did their best....).
Now could it be that when we grow up, a part of us wants to find a woman that will give us the same feeling that our moms gave us?

or in other words: could it be that we were 'conditioned' to feel good when our moms gave us good feelings and then even though we see that no woman will be like our mom- we are still searching for those good feelings our mom gave us in other women?

can you relate to what I'm saying?
As in pavlov's dogs ^^ Your mom has done so many nice things than now when you see a woman you "salivate" for all the nice things - you have been conditioned to think - she would do to you therefore your need of them ?

What if your dad was also good to you ?

Is it because you don't treat yourself as good as your mother treated you when you were younger so you always seek someone who will treat you better ? -> BE YOUR OWN BEST FRIEND
The Kidd!! wrote:
Sure can...AND NO OTHER WOMAN YOU WILL MEET HAS GIVEN BIRTH TO YOU.

Now...can you relate to what I'M saying? :geek:
So the woman who gives birth to YOU (not you Kidd, just for the exemple :)) can't be imperfect ?, and the woman you "choose" can't be too (because you expect her to be as your mother), so the problem is you looking for perfection in your life ?

What if your mother didn't treat you well, abandoned you, drowned you (well you wouldn't be here ...) would you still seek for the same kind of feelings ? Don't think so, you will also look for someone who treats you well ... so your linking good feelings and your mother is YOUR choice ...

The Kidd!! wrote:
Because a part of you still believes that women just can't be the imperfect beings we have proved them to be...can't help you with that, mate. :geek:
Imperfect as in self-interest driven ?
ManniJa wrote:
Mothers aren't perfect man, everyone is still guided by self-intrest...EVERYONE
Isn't anyone NOT guided by self-interest ?

By these two quotes, it means nobody is perfect, so everybody is perfect (even in their imperfections)

Other way to look : when you're imperfect, you see nothing as perfect, but when you are, you see EVERYTHING as perfect.
Author:  Alchemist [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
If anything it was the opposite with my mother, yet that neediness still developed, it's not black and white.

Every woman has their own reason for being 'in love' with you, that reason is backed entirely by self-interest.
Author:  peregrinus [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 10:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
ManniJa wrote:
Me and 'Grinus talked about this,

even our mothers play guilt trips on us;

"You can't come home for Christmas, you're busy? You're going to hurt the families feelings so much".

Even if we have a legite reason and it's in our best intrest.

They still look out for their own intrests more than yours

swallow that fuck'n pill!!!

Mothers aren't perfect man, everyone is still guided by self-intrest...EVERYONE!
Alchemist wrote:
Every woman has their own reason for being 'in love' with you, that reason is backed entirely by self-interest.
She 'loves' you because of what she gets out of it. Being your mother and also having you as her son.
Be assured she gets a lot out of it, in many different ways.

-

Sniper: what you believe exists in women, does not.

How perfect you think you mother is/was, she is not, she never was, she never will be.
Some of those things you thought she did for you, she did for herself.

She is a human being and as such is imperfect and flawed. That is what makes her her, what differentiates her from others.

Your imperfections and flaws make you you, what differentiates you from others.
Author:  The Kidd!! [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
GoldenBoy, I was not talking about my mother, your mother, or anyone else's mother...I was dealing with Sniper via his perspective. It really doesn't have to be this indepth every single time...you guys are just gonna end up confusing him even more in the end. :|
Author:  Sniper [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
thanks for the replies guys, now everything is more clear. Yea everyone is driven by self interest even our moms (as sad as it is...)

another thought that came into my mind was: the fact that through all my school years (and esp. kindergarten and elementary school) I only had women teachers. So when you are a little kid and you have women teachers in school telling you how great you are or how smart you are - it also creates some kind of conditioning as your brain learns to associate good feelings with women (again).

(I know some of you guys might have had bad women teachers in kindergarten and elementary school I'm talking about my experience...)

I had some women teachers that were not so good in junior high & high school, but by then I guess the 'conditioning' was already done. Also, I never had any male teachers (until I went to university).
Author:  Slim Titan [ Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
Quote:
another thought that came into my mind was: the fact that through all my school years (and esp. kindergarten and elementary school) I only had women teachers. So when you are a little kid and you have women teachers in school telling you how great you are or how smart you are - it also creates some kind of conditioning as your brain learns to associate good feelings with women (again).
I had an awesome preschool teacher, Mrs. Holloway. Her substitute Mrs. Bell was mean as shit and really disliked that bitch.

Anyway, even though Mrs. Holloway was really awesome and was probably the nicest teacher I ever had she still isn't my favorite teacher, and I rarely

associate good feelings with being told I'm smart because I hear it so damn much even at the current school I go to, where everyone is considered smart and the only real intellectual separation between students is genius and non-genius.

Remember, when a certain stimulus is given enough you become desensitized to it.
Sniper wrote:
thanks for the replies guys, now everything is more clear. Yea everyone is driven by self interest even our moms (as sad as it is...)
There's two sides to the story. Don't forget these old hags shitting out all us strong men can be altruistic in lots of occasions because they are biologically wired to.

Women are biologically wired to altruistic with nearly all close family members and some extended family members that they see enough. They get so much out of the

family thing.

Women on the street are a different ball game than one's in your corner (family). Although it is good treat family members by what they have done to help support you.
Author:  Star_Above [ Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
rkd1990 wrote:
Although it is good treat family members by what they have done to help support you.
I'm all for treating people accordingly, doesn't mean I'm gonna suddenly start eating steak again though.
Author:  Slim Titan [ Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
ahh so you are a vegan. That diet lacks balance.
Author:  The Kidd!! [ Sat Oct 15, 2011 1:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
rkd1990 wrote:
ahh so you are a vegan. That diet lacks balance.
[ img ]
Author:  Alchemist [ Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
ManniJa wrote:
rkd1990 wrote:
Although it is good treat family members by what they have done to help support you.

I'm all for treating people accordingly, doesn't mean I'm gonna suddenly start eating steak again though.
This is true, noone is exempt from the rule of treating people accordingly, that includes family.
Author:  Jared [ Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
Alchemist wrote:
This is true, noone is exempt from the rule of treating people accordingly, that includes family.
Awareness Gap, if meaningful communication is
a goal, then this will certainly hold true.

With lower awareness people, meaningful
communication best happens when the higher
awareness person lowers his/her awareness to
match the lower one´s awareness, and leads
the other person back up.

If the awareness gap is too large, then I personally
don´t aim for ANY kind of communication. (I don´t let
´em drag me down. It isn´t a big deal, because I am
the source of that experience anyway, I can consciously
choose its meaning, the rain doesn´t determine how I feel.)

On the other hand, no treatment is FINAL, so it is very
interactive event, correctible, commandable...
(if they´re smart, they´re also self-correcting.)
Author:  Jared [ Sun Oct 23, 2011 8:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
About that Awareness Gap;
(Interpersonal Communication)

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2006/0 ... eness-gap/

This is perhaps just 1 viewpoint out of many.
Author:  Ruffneck [ Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: "letting go", our mothers, new reality check...
I suppose i may have lucked out with my upbringing, as it relates to conditionning.

I am told that when i was born, i didn't cry,but rather looked around in amazement, and as a small child i wanted to have nothing to do with maternal coddling. I would fight and struggle my way out of my mother's arms when she would try to hold me.

I related more closely to my father throughout my entire youth. Part of this had to do with the fact that my mother is a teacher, and would always side with my adversaries; her colleagues, whenever i would catch shit for being disruptive in class. It was pretty clear at an early age that there were two different teams in my life, and it was pretty obvious which one she was on.

My father on the other hand, would always console me after she came uncunted and even stop her if he caught her crossing the line of mental/verbal abuse. He would say thing like "don't worry about her.. She doesn't understand you. you're a free spirit".

Perhaps this is why I've mannaged to dodge the bullet of a pre-mature, compromised, female-dominated dynamic.

As far as the letting go... I suppose it's easy enough to forgive. I don't think i really owe her any thanks, as it was not likely a deliberate effort on her part for my ultimate sake. Nothing more than a woman getting bent out of shape because she wasn't having her way.
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